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Joe Heschmeyer addresses the way in which we are called to be instruments of salvation in light of Acts 4: 12 “there is no other name under heaven given among mortals by which we must be saved.”
Transcription:
Joe:
Welcome back to James. I’m Joe Hess Meyer. A few years ago I was sharing with some Protestant friends my testimony such as it is, and I got to this part where I was explaining how I accredited a friend of mine who’s now a priest with really saving my soul in college because he was my college ra. And he patiently and clearly answered all of the doubts and questions and objections that I had about Catholicism, even as someone who’d grown up Catholic. And when I get to this part of the story, they’re visibly uncomfortable and they explained to me that from their background saying Anyone besides Jesus saved you was just another way of saying that you’re not saved. After all, there’s no other name under heaven by which we’re saved than that of Jesus Christ. So it sounded blasphemous to them, and I know it sounds incredibly blasphemous to Protestant ears when Catholics say things like Mary saves us. I think John Ankerberg speaks for a lot of Protestants when he objects that it sounds like we’re putting Mary in the place of Jesus Christ.
CLIP:
According to the Pope, the knowledge about God and even salvation comes through. Mary Pope Leo 13th prayed, oh virgin, most holy none abounds in the knowledge of God except through thee none. Oh, mother of God attains salvation except through thee none receives a gift from the throne of mercy except through thee. Pope Leo would’ve been biblically correct if he had just put Jesus’ name in place of Mary’s. Why? It’s because the Bible teaches that only through Christ can we know God. Look at John one 18. It states, no man has seen God at any time. The only begotten son who’s in the bosom of the Father, he has made him known. Second, the Bible clearly tells us salvation is only found in and through Christ, not through Mary. In Acts four 12, we read Salvation is found in no one else for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.
Joe:
So today I want to do three things. Number one, highlight where we actually agree what it is that Protestants are getting right in their objection. Number two, show why the Bible still agrees with the Catholic side that we can absolutely say that we save other people or other people have saved us. And then number three, I want to apply it to Mary, show how this applies in this unique, pretty special way to the Virgin Mary in her role of salvation. So let’s start with the first. What does the Protestant objection get? Right? Well, of course it gets right. The utter centrality of Jesus Christ. No one else dies on the cross for you. So in that clip he quoted from Acts four, and it’s worth hearing St. Peter’s words before the Sanhedrin. He says, rulers of the people and elders, if we’re being examined today concerning a good deed done to a cripple, they’re brought in after performing a miracle.
By what means this man has been healed, be it known to you all and to all the people of Israel that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead by him, this man is standing before you. Well, this is the stone which was rejected by you builders, but which has become the head of the corner, the cornerstone. In other words, and there is salvation in no one else for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved. In fact, we can add to that several other passages from the Bible. For instance, one John chapter four, he says, and this is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his son to be the expiation for our sins. Mary is not the expiation for our sins.
The saints are not the expedition of our sins. The person who led you to Jesus Christ is not the expedition for your sins. Jesus himself is of course, and a few verses later, John says, we’ve seen and testify that the Father has sent his son as the savior of the world. Anyone who he saved is saved through Jesus Christ. There is no other way. There is no other name under heaven given to men by which we are saved. The catechism agrees with all this. Obviously it says, well, maybe obvious to Catholics, some Protestants may actually believe that we think there’s another savior, marry or the saints. That’s not what’s going on here. The catechism in paragraph six 13 says, Christ’s death is both the paschal sacrifice that accomplishes the definitive redemption of men through the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. That is he is the fulfillment of what begins in a figure in the Passover and it’s the sacrifice of the new covenant which restores man to communion with God by reconciling him to God through the blood of the covenant which was poured out for for the forgiveness of sins. So make sure you don’t miss that. I mean this is hopefully an obvious straightforward point that Jesus Christ in a unique and a singular way pours out his blood for us and nobody else’s, not even the martyrs die for us in the same way.
In the next paragraph, the catechism says that the sacrifice of Christ is unique, right? Just make no mistake about it. If you think other sacrifices are like calvary, you are wrong. It completes and surpasses all other sacrifices and then it explains several ways how. First, it’s a gift from God, the father himself for the father handed his son over to sinners in order to reconcile us with himself. At the same time, it is the offering of the Son of God made man who in freedom and love offered his life to His Father through the Holy Spirit and reparation for our disobedience. So whatever else may be true, all the other ways we may save someone, we don’t save them in the way Jesus does on the cross. He alone does that. He alone is the mediator between God and men in the sense one Timothy two actually means it, which is he alone bridges the chasm caused by sin and he does it through the cross.
So if that was all said, and if that was all the catechism said, then we’d say, Hey, great. Stop saying you save other people. Stop saying other people save you. Stop saying Mary saved you. Stop all that because only Jesus is a savior. But it turns out the Bible has a lot more to say and so on. The question of can we save other people? It is a resounding yes and it is explicit and unambiguous, which is going to lead to the deeper question of how can both of these things be true? So we’re going to explore that. Let’s look at a few biblical passages. First, let’s go to James chapter five. Let’s He says, if any among you is sick, let him call for the elders of the church and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord.
And the prayer of faith will save the sick man and the Lord will raise him up and if he has committed sins, he’ll be forgiven. So you’ve called the elders presbyter, we later shortened to priest and they pray over you and this prayer of faith saves you. Now you might say, Hey, maybe that’s just a physical healing, even though it says, and if he has committed sins, they’ll be forgiven. But if there’s any ambiguity in that, there’s not. In the next few verses in verse 16, it says, therefore confess your sins to one another and pray for one another that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man has great power and his effect. So if someone is cut off from God through sin, your prayer can help restore that union. Now, maybe that’s still too vague. Let’s go a few more verses forward.
Prayer verses 19 to 20. It says, my brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from the era of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. You can save another person from death, spiritual death obviously, because you’re bringing the sinner back from the era of his ways you can save other people and you’ve just been given a roadmap for how to do it by bringing them back into the truth. Now, you don’t do it by dying on the cross for them, right? But when you leave someone to Jesus, you save them. Think about it in a medical analogy. Let’s say you’ve got a very serious illness and it will kill you, but there’s a powerful antibiotic that can cure you. That’s Christ.
That’s his sacrifice. That’s the merits he’s won for us on the cross. This is the only medicine, this is the only remedy. And so if you’re saying, well, could this other drug cure me? Could this herbal remedy cure me? No, no, no, no. Only this one antibiotic Christ. I guess he’s probiotic. He’s for life. Leave that aside for purposes of the analogy. So if Christ is the medicine, he alone can heal you, but there might be a doctor or a nurse or an orderly who brings that medicine to you and you can still say they saved you. You might have a friend who said, Hey, I think you’re actually really sick and you better get to the hospital. Really soon. When I was a baby, I had what would’ve been a terminal disease and thanks me to God, my mom took me to the doctor and when the first doctor said, he’s fine, she didn’t believe him and took me back and to get a second opinion.
And the second doctor realized I was 48 hours away from dying. My life was saved, incredible. My mother saved my life. The doctor saved my life. It’s not 50 50. They had different roles to play and my physical salvation. Well, likewise in your spiritual salvation, Jesus Christ has this utterly indispensable role. But every person along the way who shared the gospel and preserved the gospel and brought you the saving gospel of Christ has brought you that saving medicine they have saved you in some sense, not in the same sense Jesus did, of course, but in a very real sense. Nevertheless, that’s James five. Jude echoes this in the epistle to Jude in verses 20 to 23, it says, you beloved, build yourselves up on your most holy faith. Now, even that language of building yourself up I think was probably going to be uncomfortable to certain Protestant ears because it sounds too palate.
We’re doing too much pray in the Holy Spirit, keep yourselves in the love of God. Wait for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life and convince some who doubt. Save some by snatching them out of the fire. So another way we can save other people is by snatching ’em out of the fire. Particularly I would tie it to the thing that you said right before that, convincing those who doubt if you’re struggling with the faith and your friend counsels you and gives you advice and explains why the faith is rational and you should still believe they’ve turned you away from apostasy, they have saved you. This is exactly the thing that was going on in my testimony where I had these questions and these doubts and these objections and a Catholic friend very patiently, eloquently explained to me why I was wrong and why these things were true.
It turned me away from I am snatched out of the fire. That is what it means to save another person on a creaturely level. And this is not just like a one or two off. This language is found throughout the Bible. St. Paul says to Timothy, not to neglect the gift you have, which was given you by prophetic utterance when the elders laid their hands upon you. So what’s going on there? Timothy is the bishop here. And so even though he’s appointing presbyters and overseers, he is in this singular role where everyone else reports to him in the church he’s been left to tend to, and he doesn’t just have this by dictate, he has this authority sacramentally because in the laying on of hands, he was given a spiritual authority. That’s pretty much right there in the text for 74 14. But that then creates not only a spiritual power and authority, but also a spiritual duty that he has to, as St.
Paul puts it, practice these duties, devote yourselves to them, devote yourself to them so that they all may see your progress. Take heed to yourself and to your teaching. Hold to that for by so doing, you will save both yourself and your heroes. In other words, Paul is telling Timothy, be a good bishop and you’ll save both yourself in those who’ve been entrusted to you. That’s the role of every bishop. That’s the calling at least of every bishop, and that’s calling in a different way of every evangelist and every hopefully in the role that I’m in right now, I’m saving myself. And those hearing me, that sounds strange to our ears. I absolutely get that. But it is a biblical way of speaking and thinking about salvation. And if it sounds strange to us, that is a problem with us. Not a problem with the biblical text.
So St. Paul is giving us this method both to save ourselves, that’s got to make this very uncomfortable and save other people. There it is. We can’t run from the biblical language. This is not a mistake. This is not a denial that there’s no other name under heaven by which we’re saved because what is Timothy doing if he’s doing his job well, he’s leading people to Jesus Christ. So he’s saving them like the nurse who hands the saving medicine to the doctor like the doctor who gives you or administers the saving medication. Christ is secure and the way we save other people is by administering the cure or bringing them to someone who will administer the cure to them. That’s how it works. It’s beautiful. And this isn’t just a New Testament thing too. One of the clearest passages about this is actually in the Old Testament when God says to Ezekiel that he’s made him a watchman for the house of Israel.
And he tells him, if I say to the wicked, oh wicked man, you shall surely die and you do not speak to warn the wicked man to turn from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. But if you warn the wicked man to turn from his way and he does not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity, but you will have saved your life. So even if you fail in your mission, you’re a bishop, you’re a parent, you’re an evangelist, whatever it is, and you’re trying to save other people and you fail at that, the mere fact that you are following God’s prompting to give that message of salvation will save your life. And if you don’t do it, God will hold you accountable. His blood I will require at your hand, this is not faith alone.
You have to actually do something. And if you fail to do the thing God has called you to do, you can be damned because he holds you accountable for someone else’s damnation. Those are very strong words. That’s all right there in the Bible. And again, I think this is foreign from the way many modern Christians speak about salvation and that is a problem with us. Now, I’ve been talking mostly about bishops and evangelists and missionaries in this kind of big way of saving other people, and that is often what we’re called to do frankly, that we’re called to vocally share the gospel in these ways. But there are a lot of other ways where we’re called to live the Christian life in such a way that we invite other people into it. So to give another great example, I think from St. Paul in one Corinthians seven, he talks about family life and he says, if any woman has a husband who is an unbeliever and he can sense to live with her, she should not divorce him.
So a little bit of context, he’s dealing with a group of largely converts in Corinth and in many cases it was women who would convert before the men would. And there’s a lot of reasons sociologists have that they speculate about this. We don’t need to get into all of that except to say that like many people, even watching this video, you may find yourself in a situation where you’ve changed and you’ve become Christian and you’re married to someone who isn’t and there’s a denominational divide or there’s a religious divide, and that can be a really uncomfortable place and it can break apart a lot of marriages. Now another thing to note here is St. Paul is speaking to people who don’t have sacramental marriages. This is not the sacrament of marriage. This is what’s called natural marriage. And so they could get divorced and remarried, but Paul is going to recommend that they don’t do that.
He says, if he can sense to live with you, don’t divorce him for why? For the unbelieving husband is consecrated, that is made holy through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is consecrated through her husband. Otherwise your children would be unclean. But as it is, they’re holy. Now, Paul has this habit of just laying out some rich and deep theology, not really explaining it and moving on, and he does this here. What does it mean to say our children are holy? What does it mean to say we’re consecrating an unbeliever? What does any of that look like? What does that mean? The most hopeful interpretation is that we should not despair. That if you are a Christian and you have airing members of your family, you should continue to pray and intercede for them because it may be through your holiness, they will be saved.
What that looks like, Paul doesn’t tell us, maybe we’re not to know and just have to wait and see what it looks like. It may be that they have an obvious conversion. It may be in some other way. God is able to look at them and see your faith and heal them. Think about the paralytic man whose friends bring him to Jesus. Jesus looks at the faith of the friends instead to the man, your sins are forgiven and then tell them to rise and walk. So maybe what you’re called to do in this situation is to pray and intercede and patiently fight for the family member who’s gone astray, the friend who’s gone astray. Paul’s looking particularly at marriage, but I think this is something we should take great spiritual hope and without defining something that isn’t given to us to define. So we can’t just declare this person is definitely saved because of their faithful mom or whatever.
We don’t know that, but we have grounds to hope that we can save others in some mysterious way that St. Paul is briefly sketching out here. He then considers the case, well, what if the other person doesn’t stay with you? What if the unbelieving partner wants to separate? He says, let it be so in such a case the brother or sister is not bound for God has called us to peace. This is what’s sometimes called the Pauline privilege that you can divorce and remarry. If your first marriage is not a sacramental one and the unbelieving unbaptized partner leaves you, then you’re good to go. This is not a binding marriage in the eyes of God, the way a sacramental marriage is. There’s much more that could be said, but this isn’t a video about canon loss. I’m going to leave that aside, but that’s where that comes from if you’re curious.
The next line though is what I really want to focus on. Verse 16, wife, how do you know whether you will save your husband? Husband? How do you know whether you will save your wife? Now, I think John Engberg would have to say, well, we can’t save them. There’s no other name under heaven by which we’re saved. And Paul would say, you’re missing what I mean by saved. We’re not saving them like Christ saves us. We’re saving them in a subordinate way. We’re saving them in a way where we’re applying Christ’s unique sacrifice to their lives through our prayer and mediation, intercession, all of these things, we’re bringing them to the one mediator. That’s the biblical picture. And this is what I think is often missed when people have this zero sum mindset that if Christ is the Savior of the world, then no one else has any kind of svi role.
That’s just not biblical. That’s not true. It’s not logical. To give one more example, if you said, Hey, who painted the Sistine Chapel ceiling? Was it Michelangelo or was it Botticelli? That is a coherent question and it couldn’t be a hundred percent of both. If it was 50% of one, it could be at most 50% of the other. But if you said, who painted the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel? Was it Michelangelo or was it paintbrushes? That question just reveals a fundamentally misunderstood sense of agency because it’s a hundred percent Michelangelo and a hundred percent paintbrushes as well. And there’s no tension between that whatsoever because the paintbrushes are what are called an instrumental cause Michelangelo uses those to paint the ceiling. Well, likewise, God uses the various people in our lives to bring us to salvation, and we can both say God has saved us and they have saved us.
There’s no contradiction there. They’re working in different ways at different levels of causality. So let’s this biblical concept to three people, St. Paul, St. Patrick and the Virgin Mary. I want to begin with St. Paul in one Timothy chapter four. Remember that line that if Timothy does what he’s supposed to do, he will save both himself and his heroes. Paul describing himself puts it like this in Romans 11. He says, now I’m speaking to you Gentiles in as much then as I’m an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry in order to make my fellow Jews jealous and thus save some of them. So okay, we think of Paul as the apostle do the Gentiles, but he’s very clear that he’s trying to save us absolutely, but also trying to save his fellow Jews. Anyone who heard that and was converted by it could say, Jesus saved me and St.
Paul saved me. This would not be blasphemy, this would not be contradiction. This would be strictly biblical. Or you could take the example of St. Patrick. If you’re Irish and you are a believing Christian, you can thank St. Patrick, right? He is the apostle to Ireland. And so what had been a pagan country becomes a Christian country. And so you could say Who saved you? Well, was it Jesus? Of course, absolutely. Was it St. Patrick also? Yes. Now that’s true. Even centuries later, maybe you didn’t meet the person who brought Christianity to your shores, to your town, to your family, but you were saved by them or you were saved by someone who was saved by someone who is saved by them and so on. So you can trace that kind of lineage back and you can rightly say that they saved you. And again, this is not blasphemy.
This is not denying the singular act of Christ on the cross. This is just recognizing that Christ’s plan of salvation includes the cooperation of the saints, includes the cooperation of Christians. We are called to be partners with Christ in sharing the saving gospel. And so we can have the dignity of causality. Someone could be saved because of what you chose to do when you could have said, no, this is a good thing. This is something we should rejoice in. This is good news. Okay, so we’ve talked about St. Paul. We’ve talked about St. Patrick. Now let’s talk about the Virgin Mary. In what way can we say that the virgin Mary saves us? Well, several ways. If we can talk about Paul as the apostle to the Gentiles, because he brings the saving message. Mary brings Jesus literally into the world. The passage I’m always struck by is in John six when Jesus says that he’s the living bread come down from heaven, and he says, the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh.
Jesus doesn’t just save us in a generic way. He saves us on the cross by dying in the flesh for us. And who’s responsible for this? Well, the virgin Mary. Mary gives him his flesh. I don’t mean that Mary takes Jesus’s free will, not that at all. But Mary in her yes to God is an important role to play in the incarnation. If you miss this, if you reduce Mary to just like a shell and not truly a mother, then you’ve missed something really important. She is the mother of God. She’s the mother of Jesus Christ who is God as Elizabeth says, she’s mother of my Lord. And she cooperates with that freely. So when he has flesh to give for the life of the world, it’s because Mary says yes to the angel Gabriel Lumen Gen Second Vatican counsel puts it like this, predestined from eternity by that decree of divine providence which determined the incarnation of the word to be the mother of God.
The blessed virgin was on this earth, the virgin mother of the redeemer, and above all others, and in a singular way, the generous associated in humble, handmade of the Lord she conceived, brought forth and nourished Christ. So in what way does Mary save us? First by saying yes to the incarnation, she’s the handmaid of the Lord. She freely cooperates with the plan of salvation. She could have said, no, I think this is an important thing to make clear she didn’t have to say yes to the angel Gabriel. Now, Protestants when they hear that will say, well, God would’ve found another way. Sure, likewise, if St. Patrick hadn’t gone to Ireland, maybe somebody else, you can always do those kind of counterfactuals. If the person who did save you didn’t, maybe someone else would’ve saved you. It doesn’t matter. The point is she did save us by saying yes to the incarnation so that redemption would come through her into the world and the person of Jesus Christ.
Second Mary presents Jesus to the Father in the temple and was united with him by compassion as he died on the cross. In this singular way, she cooperated by her obedience, faith, hope, and burning charity in the work of the Savior and giving back supernatural life to souls. Where for She’s our mother in the order of grace, like she is the first and most faithful disciple of Jesus. When the apostles save John don’t show up on good Friday, Mary’s there. She sticks with it. And so that’s the second way she’s sharing in the gospel by being a faithful disciple and by being a faithful disciple who gives him to the Father. In the presentation we see that. We see it also when at the wedding Feast of Cana, where Jesus says His hour hasn’t come and Mary gives him the push. She says to the stewards, the servants of the feast do whatever he tells you.
And she launches Jesus’s public ministry through her intercession. Just read John two. It’s right there. Third, the maternity of marrying the order of grace began with the consent which she gave in faith at the enunciation in which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross and last until the eternal fulfillment of all the elect. In other words, this isn’t just historically true because she’s not dead now taken up to heaven, she did not lay aside the sic duty, but by her constant intercession continued to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation. Now, look, I understand Catholics and Protestants often disagree about what it is the saints are experiencing in heaven right now, and that many Protestants are uneasy with the idea the saints are alive in heaven. Like Jesus says when he’s responding to the Sadducees and says, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob are alive, God is the God of the living and not the dead.
And so they’re worried about saying, oh, you’re praying to the dead, et cetera. No, we’re praying to the living. That’s not a quibble, that’s biblical. But here, Mary is alive in heaven and she’s interceding force because here’s the thing, all the saints in heaven intercede. So leaving aside whether we should pray to Mary, put all that question aside for a minute, Mary is certainly praying for us because she is holy and she cares about us and she loves us. In Revelation 1217, the mother of Jesus is presented as the mother of those who hold to the testimony of Christ. Now, you can say that’s Israel or the church or Mary or all of the above. It certainly looks to me like all of the above and any case, anyone who’s holy in heaven is praying and interceding for other people because if you’re that selfish that you wouldn’t do that, you’re not making it to heaven, right?
Alright. Fourth, by her maternal charity, Mary cares for the brethren of her son who’s still journey on earth surrounded by dangerous and difficulties until they’re led into the happiness of their true home. And so for those reasons, we’re told the Blessed Virgin is invoked by the church under titles like Advocate, auxiliary and Metrix. Now, I get those kinds of titles sound really unpleasant to Protestant ears. I get that. I absolutely get it because we’re used to thinking in zero some way where it sounds like we’re saying there are two mediators between God and man, Jesus and Mary. That’s not what we’re saying. And the Second Vatican Council is actually really clear when we talk about Mary saving us or mediating or any of these things, we don’t mean in the way that Jesus is the unique savior and the unique mediator. We don’t mean that at all explicitly in the next paragraph.
This however, is to be so understood that it neither takes away from nor adds anything to the dignity and efficacious of Christ, the one mediator. So it isn’t that Mary adds something to the cross, make it a little bit better, nor is it like Mary takes away. So it’s 50 50, not that at all. Jesus is doing a singular thing. Mary’s cooperation isn’t at that point. That’s not what we’re describing here. For no creature Vatican two says could ever be counted as equal with the incarnate word. And Redeemer, just as the preset of Christ is shared in various ways, both by the ministers and by the faithful and as the one goodness of God is really communicated in different ways to his creatures. So also the unique mediation of the redeemer does not exclude, but rather gives rise to a manifold cooperation, which is but a sharing in this one source.
That’s everything we’ve seen so far that Christ’s unique action doesn’t preclude us from cooperating. It makes it possible. Like Jesus doesn’t die on the cross to take away our cross. He dies on the cross. So our cross can have meaning. We can make up in our own bodies what is lacking in the sufferings of Christ. As St. Paul says, this is the invitation that the Bible lays out quite clearly, and if we’ve got theological blinders on that don’t let us see that that’s a problem on us, not a problem with the Bible. Lastly, Vatican two says, the church does not hesitate to profess this subordinate role to Mary. If you’ve been told the church views Mary as equal to Jesus or above Jesus or anything like that, that is a lie. That is a fiction. And Vatican two is being very clear. No Mary is subordinate to Christ.
It knows it through the unfailing experience of it and commends it to the hearts of the faithfuls that encouraged by this maternal help. They may the more intimately adhere to the mediator and redeemer that Mary’s role is to lead us to Jesus. Remember her last words in the gospel of John are, do whatever he tells you. That is her cooperation with Christ. She’s helping to bring Jesus into the world by launching his public ministry, but she’s also making clear that her life is referential. Her life refers us to Jesus, that the reason we as Christians care about Mary isn’t for Mary’s own sake apart from Christ. The reason we care about Mary is because we care about Christ. As you go back through the history of the church, the whole controversy over whether we call Mary, mother of God or not, is based on what we believe about Jesus Christ.
It’s not drawing us away from him, it’s leading us to him. And so the people who have the healthiest relationship with Mary have the healthiest relationship with Jesus. So if you are coming from a place where your own background makes you allergic to saying somebody else saves you, and Mary saves you any of these things, I hope this has been a good biblical provocation or even revelation, right, to show you, look, scripture speaks and thinks and acts in a way that you don’t speak and think and act, and that this might mean that there’s an alignment needed. I hope this is helpful. I really look forward to hearing your comments below because I know this can be kind of a contentious issue and I hope we can keep it civil and encouraging. And by all means, if you’ve got objections and questions, I want to give you permission. Ask those below, and I know many other people would be happy to help answer the things you might be struggling with. If this is giving you some unease for Shamus, Joe Meyer, God bless you.